![]() |
|
|
|||
| • |
This is the place to ask questions and share information about the 60's Batmobile & more. |
||
| • | This is a '66 Batmobile related board, so please stay on topic. | ||
| • | Do not not post any messages that are abusive, hostile, rude, obscene, vulgar, hateful, intimidating, threatening, or violates any laws. | ||
| • | Remember this board is only as good as the posters and not the lurkers so register and have fun! | ||
|
|
Thanks to the following people for donating to the board and keeping it ad free! |
||
|
|
|||
|
|
|||
| Author | Comment | ||
|---|---|---|---|
thekgb |
MUST READ |
Lead | |
|
|
|||
66BAT |
|||
|
Having a lifelong interest in the Batmobile, all the builders as they have come and gone, and all the controversy about rights with respect to commercial use,
I must say I would LOVE to be on the jury for that case, it would be fascinating to hear and see firsthand what gets presented as evidence and arguments and
then see how the legal system views and judges on it.
I'm not bashing the builder in saying that, there are multiple issues brought in this case not just the car missing it's completion date, and of course there are always 2 sides to every legal case. If the builder were to defend statements the customer claims he made about commercial use of the car then evidence would have to be presented to back that up and the court would have to rule on it, it would be very interesting! I wonder too if the customer in this case has given up on getting a 66 Batmobile after this, or has he gone to a different builder, or possibly bought one of the several replicas for sale recently? |
|||
nodeman |
|||
|
I was wondering when someone was going to post that. The complainant has contacted several members of this board who has also had problems with this builder. I
am not sure if he is looking for more litigants or others to back him up when he goes to trial; this should get interesting.
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
Two things strike me right away about this lawsuit:
|
|||
nodeman |
|||
|
It says in the complaint that he paid the defendant 85 thousand of the 90 thousand dollars directly to the defendant. From the way it reads it sounds like the usual contract MT was issued. |
|||
thekgb |
Thats what i thought at 1st | ||
|
with the name Mike C er i mean Hunt...but it is legit
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
Well, certainly I have no real ill will towards anyone involved in this, and no basis to comment on whether the lawsuit is really "legit" or
frivolous--as real as it may be. I just kid Mr. Hunt and his folks, because I saw Porky's and heard the Tube Bar tapes too many times. It's
impossible for me not to leap right to that association whenever I hear/see that name. Nothing personal at all.
If he's as philanthropic as the court complaint portrays, then he's an admirable guy for sure, although the part about wanting extra money in punitive damages for being humiliated and his reputation tarnished seems a bit much. If he's that charitable and continues to be, his rep will be fine, and people will continue to be grateful for his charitable contributions. Maybe I'm a little idealistic, but charity isn't really supposed to be about the credit or reputation you get anyway. It's supposed to be simply about doing something good for the community, and the fact that people applaud it is a fringe benefit. Sincerely, Stu Pitt (no relation to Brad)
|
|||
thekgb |
I have a feeling | ||
|
A little bird says this is not the last of the lawsuits comin' his way...it is unfortunate.
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
What a shame. Again, having really no basis to comment on MT, or his situation, or his clients' experiences, that just sounds bad no matter who's side
you're on. Doesn't sound like anyone's coming out a winner here.
My brother's getting ready to sue a body shop that took his money to fix his car after a horrible accident, and have had his car over 5 months, his money for over 4 months, and have not done even one second of work on the car, and don't ever intend to. Why he paid them before the work was even started is beyond me, but they've done this many times to many people, and have never been successfully sued, because they simply dismantle the company after they get paid and change the name of the business, and claim to have nothing to do with the previous company that took the money/have completely different management, etc. Professional crooks. Naive brother. |
|||
nodeman |
|||
|
I am sure with that amount of money involved and what the complainant is claiming to be true, this would come under a criminal offence, felony fraud. |
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
Without any sort of info from MT's side (or even from other "victims"), it's hard to determine. There's always the possibility that
WB/DC got involved and squashed the project--the seller claimed that one use would be to sell Batman related items during the DK movie run-up, and it's not
clear if that was to go to charity or simply for profit (which I'm sure would raise eyebrows if WB/DC found out about it, unless the plaintiff already had
express permission from them). Taking the car around to show off and display at charity/non-profit events is one thing, but using the car to make money is
another.
Also, you never know what may have happened during the last year to screw things up--MT may have had the best intentions and then been slammed w/some financial catastrophe that wiped out whatever funds he had been planning to use for builds, I could dream up lots of scenarios that don't really involve fraud. By the way, this is a civil case--not criminal--according to the paperwork posted. I'm sure the plaintiff would have filed a criminal case if he thought he had one--it would vastly increase his chances in the civil case if there was a criminal conviction and possibly help a bit even if MT were to be aquitted (remember the OJ fiasco?--Goldman won the civil suit), and I'm sure Mr. Hunt's attorney would know that. Nodeman--of course there is the possibility that it's just a case of taking the money and not doing the work which would be fraud/stealing whatever you want to call it. Or if he knew he wouldn't be able to deliver on his promises and took the jobs/money anyway hoping that no one would sue him if he took too long to get the work done, or if he used the money to build his own project hoping to sell it and make a ton of profit, then get to the other projects....who knows. There was that auction for the '89 not too long ago, so presumably he was doing some building at least for his own purposes. I just think all of this is wild speculation until we have more info and more details from more people who are in a position to really know what's going on. |
|||
thekgb |
Truly understand | ||
|
Your position Batusi..but must also understand their reputation throughout the boards..this is not surprising...would love to hear the other side of the
story...
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
Yup. Like I said, I know nothing about MT or his reputation really except from the other thread about his '89 build auction. I'm curious to see how
it all plays out. I just tend to give anyone the benefit of the doubt until there's more info--innocent until proven guilty (or sort of...sometimes proof
is difficult even when the reality is pretty obvious to most people).
BTW, that little aside about philanthropy comes from my own family experience. We just lost a beloved family member who was extremely generous and had that attitude of feeling that it was a privelege to be able to be a philanthropist (as opposed to an obligation or a means to gain recognition). So, that being on my mind very much lately (we lost him just a week ago), I realize I was being a bit tough on the plaintiff for wanting punitive damages. |
|||
nodeman |
|||
|
Batusi you must be new to the boards, most of us know how this group operates. All one needs to do is to read some of the posts on this board and others to realize what is going on. What is surprising is that it took this long for his actions to catch up to him.
http://1966batvehicles.yuku.com/forum/viewtopic/id/1467
http://1966batvehicles.yuku.com/topic/1474?page=2
http://www.chickslovethecar.com/board/Topic66814-12-4.aspx
http://www.chickslovethecar.com/board/Topic59039-12-2.aspx
Last Edited By: nodeman
05/25/09 10:08 PM.
Edited 3 times.
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
actually, I've been kicking around this board for over two years, since back before it was a yuku board. I just never really spent much time reading the
replica sections at all, since there's no way I could ever afford to have one built. I only started peeking at the off topic board recently because I
wanted to post something there not long ago, and then got curious about some of the threads.
the CTLC board I just took a peek at recently for the first time. I'm not a chick. I only like the car. (just kidding!) I'll look at the threads--thanks for posting the links. That's a major time-saver--much appreciated. Update: I read through most of the threads. All I can think is "Holy Bats**t!" Some nightmare-ish experiences.
Last Edited By: Batusi
05/26/09 6:24 AM.
Edited 1 times.
|
|||
thekgb |
Welcome Batusi | ||
|
To the real world of what goes on over there...glad you have a chance and gave it a chance to read whats all going on...still would like to hear from the other
side, but probably wont..too sad actually...
|
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
Personally, I can do without the all capslock, run-on/no punctuation whatsoever, horrendus spelling, terrible grammar posts. But that's cuz I already read some of them and got a headache. Ugh! Seriously, though, those stories are horrible. I wish the pics from CA WOODSIDE were still up--I can only imagine based on the descriptions. The pics from B. Wayne on CTLC were pretty scary-looking. It's interesting that one or two people posted about other cars in MT's shop looking great, w/paint "like glass." |
|||
66BAT |
|||
|
I don't think WB/DC or anybody on the corporate level could have squashed the project....for them to have a legal leg to stand on wouldn't the car have
to be completed and PROVEN to be in use commercially? In other words, no crime had yet been committed that WB/DC types could have held legal action over.
They can't stop any of us from "building" a Batmobile, but perhaps how we "use" it, or "advertise" it, or perhaps if a builder advertises his kits with their logo's etc. but in this case it doesn't even sound like a car was built (at least per the document posted here anyways), or at least not even to a stage one might call it a Batmobile, so I personally doubt WB/DC types would have tried to stop this project. There was rumor that WB/DC types had been after MT awhile back--no idea if there is any truth to that at all or not, but if they DID come down on him back them, perhaps they COULD stop him now if legal action such as a cease and desist type order had been issued. Other builders though have had heat from WB/DC types and they seem to still be in business in the end, so who really knows. The man suing in this case may be asking for punitive monies because he felt a legitimate injustice was made against him, and if so he certainly would be entitled to them and it doesn't make him greedy or anything, in fact he may be planning to donate those monies to the same charity if he wins them for all we know. We are just a web chat room here, looking at a simple legal document that only states one side of the case, so really ANYTHING we speculate on is purely that, speculation. But I do find the whole case fascinating, and if there is any truth to it, very sad. I don't wish ANY Batmobile potential owner to be denied a car so few of us will ever own, and I don't wish any builder legal issues or customer issues....the more reliable and honest builders we get, the better the replicas will get, and MAYBE someday more of us could afford one if there was more genuine competition amongst reputible builders. Hopefully lawsuits like this one won't end up hurting our cottage industry and shutting it down somehow! |
|||
Batusi |
|||
|
I'm totally with you, 66BAT. Well put!
|
|||
66Batmobile |
|||
|
On another note, does anyone know the exact details of why Jay Ohrberg lost his '66 Batmobile to WB?
Last Edited By: 66Batmobile
05/27/09 7:48 AM.
Edited 1 times.
|
|||
thekgb |
|||
|
Didnt know he did? When was this?
|
|||